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stillhunter



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PostSubject: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 0:48

It appears everyone is fond of powder instead of pellets. What are the benefits of powders? I thought the hollow pellets performed better than powders w inlines and the primers fire shot through the hole in the pellets helping to ignite the whole charge faster than from a burn from the rear to the bullet as w a packed powder charge?  I also like the speed and ease of priming w the pellets compared to pouring powder. What am I missing (no pun intended )
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FrontierGander
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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 0:59

Loose powder makes adjusting/fine tuning your loads a lot easier, it comes in a sealed can and lasts for years VS 1 year to a year and a half tops for pellets. Loose powder is also a lot cheaper.

Pellets do not burn any cleaner or faster than loose powder, pretty much a marketing myth to sell inaccurate, moisture absorbing pellets that claim they are faster to reload with.

Speed loaders or powder tubes are just as fast to reload with.
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patocazador
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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 5:44

Pellets suck.

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stillhunter



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 10:12

Well, I have only shot Pyrodex pellets since I bought my Optima and my pellets are 5 yo at least. I recently sighted in a new scope and it was shooting well @ 100 yrds 2-3" group . I've never had a misfire and store them in ziplock bags. As I said before it is getting hard to find .45 cal Powerbelts and pellets locally where I got them before so I may have to change my loads/bullets. I do have the option of driving to Ed's as I'm about an hour away.  Another question do you guys weigh the powder charges or measure them by volume?
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jhelmuth



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 11:15

I weigh my charges....
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Spitfire



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 12:15

Nothing wrong with a volumetric measure as well...
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patocazador
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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 13:40

I weigh mine.

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Spitfire



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 13:46

I tried weighing my black and tested it against volumetric loads and their was not a big enough difference for me to say 'eureka !' so volume it is for me.


Last edited by Spitfire on Tue 9 Sep - 14:51; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 14:01

Volume for me. I only weigh my loads when shooting Blackhorn209 and thats ONLY when I am at the range working up load data for that rifle.
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Spitfire



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 14:52

Yes if it works why mess with it ?
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jhelmuth



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 16:39

@Spitfire wrote:
Yes if it works why mess with it ?

Normally aspirated engines work too - but they messed with it and found that Fuel Injection produced more MPG and better emissions.

...now - don't get me wrong - there is a lot to love in some of those older autos. But just because it's working is not always a good reason to be satisfied.

The verdict is still out with me. I do not have enough experience in the ML world to draw ANY conclusions (yet).  And... no offense Spitfire - but there is equally nothing wrong with weighing powder either.  You'll find that in MOST of the firearms community, this is considered mucho more accurate (more consistency and precision = better accuracy). Having said that, there are powders which are formulated and better dispensed by volume. Is that true for Blackhorn209 (all I'll shoot)... maybe. ...for ALL powders - probably not.

I just want to keep an open mind and use the best technique(s) available to me.  Accuracy IS important even if I only consider that it improves my chances of making a more humane kill.


...just my 2-cents

jim
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biddler2



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 16:52

I know when I used pellets they seemed fine but I wasn't shooting enough to use an entire box in 2 year period and would have some left over going to the range to check zero before the hunting season. I was constantly low each year going to the range and when I get a new box and shoot comparing to the old I would have a huge shift in poi. This told me they were losing energy by absorbing water. 
Switched to BH209 and consistency stays the same even on 3 year old powder stored in a speed loader. I can't say using pellets and loose powder takes anymore time in the field if you use lanes powder tubes. It might be faster. I started with a cheap Frankford arsenal scale to weigh and it works well but I started reloading and got a Hornady electronic powder dispenser and can throw 30 loads in 20 minutes.

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GregK

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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 23:37

Here's what I know about pellets,
When you break down the cost pellets can cost as much as $90 lb.
All pellets are corrosive
All pellets are more susceptible to moisture & actually draw moisture
All pellets DO NOT weigh the same
Accurizing loads is not possible
Pellets leave crud rings & are much more difficult to clean
It was designed for #11 ignition & can be used in a variety of guns

What I know about BH209
I've burnt probably 40lbs or better of the stuff
It is cheaper than pellets (especially T-7)
It isn't corrosive (rust is caused by moisture contamination with the after burn by products)
It is not moisture sensitive (it does not attract moisture)
Working up loads in 5 grain increments is easy
It does NOT cause a crud ring......EVER
It has much more energy & velocity than any pellet.
It was designed for 209 ignition & inline rifles

As for measuring, black powder & black powder substitutes can be measured by volume or weight as long as you have the proper weight conversion chart.
However these powders are not nearly as sensitive as smokeless powders where one grain can make a difference. If you don't believe me, spill a couple grains when you load your gun & see what happens. I've turned in a 3 shot 3/4" group at 200 yards with a 110gr volumetric load. I don't care how much I weigh loads, I won't get better results & yes I do have an RCBS Chargemaster 1500 that I use for my smokeless loads.
So all I'm saying here is do what you like to do best. As long as your shooting good it doesn't really matter & there is no right or wrong on this issue.

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I hunt with the best

McRem 40cal SML

LEUPOLD 4-12X40 VX-R 30mm, CDS, FIRE DOT
CEB 40/240, 76gr IMR 4895
2600 ft/s

CVA APEX .358 SML & .45 ML
LUEPOLD 4-12X50 VX-R CDS, FIRE DOT, WIND PLEX

Knight Mountainer LTD
45cal / 1-20 twist
LEUPOLD 4-12X50 VX-R 30mm WIND PLEX CDS FIREDOT
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jhelmuth



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Tue 9 Sep - 23:59

Well said GregK...  +1   (from the voice of experience)  cheers
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Spitfire



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Wed 10 Sep - 1:49

Greg is right ....I'm getting lazy that's why I use volume and like you mentioned about the powder used Jim I only use black powder so weighing is not really needed.
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stillhunter



Number of posts : 46
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Location : Apex N.C.
Registration date : 2014-09-05

PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Sat 13 Sep - 22:48

@GregK wrote:
Here's what I know about pellets,
When you break down the cost pellets can cost as much as $90 lb.
All pellets are corrosive
All pellets are more susceptible to moisture & actually draw moisture
All pellets DO NOT weigh the same
Accurizing loads is not possible
Pellets leave crud rings & are much more difficult to clean
It was designed for #11 ignition & can be used in a variety of guns

What I know about BH209
I've burnt probably 40lbs or better of the stuff
It is cheaper than pellets (especially T-7)
It isn't corrosive (rust is caused by moisture contamination with the after burn by products)
It is not moisture sensitive (it does not attract moisture)
Working up loads in 5 grain increments is easy
It does NOT cause a crud ring......EVER
It has much more energy & velocity than any pellet.
It was designed for 209 ignition & inline rifles

As for measuring, black powder & black powder substitutes can be measured by volume or weight as long as you have the proper weight conversion chart.
However these powders are not nearly as sensitive as smokeless powders where one grain can make a difference. If you don't believe me, spill a couple grains when you load your gun & see what happens. I've turned in a 3 shot 3/4" group at 200 yards with a 110gr volumetric load. I don't care how much I weigh loads, I won't get better results & yes I do have an RCBS Chargemaster 1500 that I use for my smokeless loads.
So all I'm saying here is do what you like to do best. As long as your shooting good it doesn't really matter & there is no right or wrong on this issue.

....Thank you Greg and thanks for all the replies. You have convinced me to switch to powder, and the Buckhorn is on my list. I might have to use the remaining pellets to toss in my backyard bonfires !
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Spitfire



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Sun 14 Sep - 2:45

You won't look back when you change SH
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ram2



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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Sun 14 Sep - 16:09

@GregK wrote:
Here's what I know about pellets,

It was designed for #11 ignition & can be used in a variety of guns



Is this true?  I thought the drive to 209 primers was due to pellet ignition issues with #11 caps.
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GregK

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PostSubject: Re: Powder/pellets   Sun 14 Sep - 22:05

Pellets were introduced & used with #11 caps before the advancement to 209 systems.In most cases ignition was was fine. The shortcoming with pellets came with the introduction of T7 pellets. And while they are harder to ignite some guys had no issues while others just used a small amount of loose BP to fuel the ignition.It was more successful in inlines because the flame was directedinto the middle of the pellet. 209 primers did work better but still can't cure the problems caused by pellets attracting  moisture like a magnet attracts metal. 209 caused huge problems with the T7 pellets creating hard crud rings & horrible residue. This brought the T7(M) series primer because they were hotter than caps but not as hot as a full strength 209. Still not the perfect answer, but an improvement over the regular 209

_________________
I hunt with the best

McRem 40cal SML

LEUPOLD 4-12X40 VX-R 30mm, CDS, FIRE DOT
CEB 40/240, 76gr IMR 4895
2600 ft/s

CVA APEX .358 SML & .45 ML
LUEPOLD 4-12X50 VX-R CDS, FIRE DOT, WIND PLEX

Knight Mountainer LTD
45cal / 1-20 twist
LEUPOLD 4-12X50 VX-R 30mm WIND PLEX CDS FIREDOT
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