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VAKnight

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PostSubject: Superformance Ammo?   January 31st 2011, 12:19 am

I was working with my son today with his Apex and a 270 barrel. My hand loads were doing pretty good after about 20 rounds (56 gr. RL-19 and 130 gr Hornady SST - Medium High load), so on a whim I decided to try a new box of 140 gr. Hornady Superformance ammo. The first several loads had some pretty serious blow back. The 4th load was difficult to open the Apex. The 5th load opened the Apex upon firing and the brass shot out towards my face and the primer blew out of the case and I had to pick it out of my face.

I am trying to decide which I trust less...the Hornady ammo or the Apex.

But I am just darned surprised that the recoil opened the rifle up and the cartridge ended up in my face.

Ideas anyone?

I just wanted to let you guys know so you can be careful.

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Omega45

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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   January 31st 2011, 2:09 am

Sounds like you should call Bergara Barrels and Hornady. The Superformance ammo is suppose to be 200 fps faster then regular ammo from what I read. Hornady may have never tested it in a break open gun but they should have. Glad to hear you are OK.
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Marty
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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   January 31st 2011, 6:22 am

Shocked Wow...that doesn't sound good at all. I wouldn't think 200 f.p.s. to be a significant enough increase from standard velocity to cause such radical behavior in the action. I think FG has a .30-06 barrel for the Apex which I believe he shot and didn't have any problems. The Apex action should be plenty strong enough as they make some hefty calibers for it like the .35 Whelen.

I'd contact the folks at CVA before I'd blame it on the ammo. Personally, if that happened to me I'd ship the Apex back to CVA for inspection before I shot it again.
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The Butcher

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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   January 31st 2011, 2:07 pm

I have to agree with Marty on this one. I'd first contact CVA. Hornady claims 200 fps faster, and that it is "rocket science"! If you have a Rem 700 or Win model 70 in .270 at your disposal, I'd fire a round down range in one of those and see if there is signs of pressure. I handload for about 20 different cartridges, and to get 200 extra fps, would require very careful loading. I'm sure Hornady uses proprietary powders for this ammo, and has also done extensive testing.

Is it possible the chamber is out of SAAMI Specs? An oversize chamber, or short throat, would cause excessive pressure. Like Marty said, they offer some stout cartridges, like the .35 Whelen, and .300 Win Mag.

I'm interested in your findings, before I dump any cash into a barrel. I really don't need a barrel, as after 30 + years of hunting, I have enought centerfires, but having the option of a switch barrel gun is appealing.

Please keep us posted.
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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   January 31st 2011, 2:24 pm

holy moly! thats some major pressure for that to happen. I'd call CVA and then hornady. Something aint right on that at all.

Did you make sure the rifle was closed all the way? i know if the headspace is to long on the bullet, it wont close all the way.

I'll copy this and send an email as well.
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VAKnight

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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   February 2nd 2011, 8:46 pm

It opened and closed just fine with the reloads with what seemed to be tight lock up.

My hand loads were doing great with decent groups (they are the load I use in my Ruger #1 and a Savage bolt gun).

The round or two before the opening up had seriously flattened primers and gas leakage signs from around the primers. The last shot, was as I said, interesting.

I emailed Hornady and I will wait to see what they say.

I will be sending the rifle back to CVA in the near future.

What a heartbreaker...I adore this rifle even though I got it for one of my middle sons.

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Traditions 32 Caliber Crockett Squirrel Rifle - 70 gr Buffalo Ballette, 40 gr FFFG 777
CVA Stag Horn 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 225 gr Powerbelt, 2 - 50 gr 777
CVA Optima 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
CVA Accura 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
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FrontierGander
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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   February 2nd 2011, 9:38 pm

boy that sounds as if the bullets were being jammed up into the rifling and causing high pressures to build. I dont have much experience but when i reloaded for my apex '06 the bullets were touching the rifling and when i removed the bullet "unfired" the bullet tip actually pulled out of the case.
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johnp034

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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   February 3rd 2011, 12:51 am

I've fired Superformance ammo in my very old Mauser military 7x57 with no ill effects. Matter of fact, it shot extremely well. No high pressure signs at all. But I would certainly let CVA & Hornady know whats happening.

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VAKnight

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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   February 4th 2011, 6:46 pm

Hornady has responded and they want me to send back what is left.

I still need to give CVA a call.

Thank you for all your input.

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My friends call me Scotty

Traditions 32 Caliber Crockett Squirrel Rifle - 70 gr Buffalo Ballette, 40 gr FFFG 777
CVA Stag Horn 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 225 gr Powerbelt, 2 - 50 gr 777
CVA Optima 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
CVA Accura 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
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VAKnight

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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   February 4th 2011, 7:07 pm

Sometimes a picture is worth a thousand words. This is a side view.




This is an end view.





First of all, I am not an expert cameraman. In the top pic, the left is unfired 270 140 gr superformance ammo. In the middle is the fired ammo. To the right is my standard 270 hand load. If you look hard, you can see clear marking lines near the case head. Pretty much what I look for in case/head potential separations. It is not easy to see, but in the middle fired one, the brass case neck surrounding the 140 gr round, the brass is almost red - like it was way overheated on firing. The round to the right on my standard hand load, looks pretty much normal.

In the lower pic, you can see the gas path as the primer came to visit me.

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My friends call me Scotty

Traditions 32 Caliber Crockett Squirrel Rifle - 70 gr Buffalo Ballette, 40 gr FFFG 777
CVA Stag Horn 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 225 gr Powerbelt, 2 - 50 gr 777
CVA Optima 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
CVA Accura 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
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FrontierGander
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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   February 4th 2011, 7:39 pm

i see the red. I wonder if hornady over loaded them? Ive never seen anything like that before.

Have you been able to call cva or hornady?
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VAKnight

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PostSubject: Re: Superformance Ammo?   February 5th 2011, 7:44 am

Hornady wrote me back and wants me to send them what is left for their review.

I have yet to talk with CVA.

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My friends call me Scotty

Traditions 32 Caliber Crockett Squirrel Rifle - 70 gr Buffalo Ballette, 40 gr FFFG 777
CVA Stag Horn 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 225 gr Powerbelt, 2 - 50 gr 777
CVA Optima 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
CVA Accura 45 Caliber - Bushnell 1.75x - 4.5x Scope, 275 gr Powerbelt, 3 - 50 gr 777
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